While we're working on finishing up the spell list for Arcane and Divine casters, I'm going to start my Bard retool. I'll post more info later, but here's the quick rundown: Bards are going to lose MP and will have sing re-written.

Songs will no longer be on a 2 minute timer, and will now be something a bard continues to do to keep the effect active. For example: To heal, a bard might sing Melkor's Melody of Healing. To fight, he might sing Johny's Fighting Jingle. Each song he sings will "pulse" an effect that stays active for 10-15 seconds, and is refreshed every 5 seconds or so while singing. Some songs will be boosted by certain instruments, and others will require one! (Disaron's Divine Drumbeat!)

Targets for songs will include 1) Self, 2) Party, 3) Room, 4) Players, 5) Monsters, 6) Enemies, etc. Songs will be learned through the bard college and questing.


I'll post more information when I've finalized my planning!

-Bane

I like it, but losing MP is a bit harsh. Would it make sense to keep their MP and just not be able to cast while singing? That would allow them to not lose out on spells like know aura, D-I, D-M, bless and pro, and most importantly infravision.

Could a party of bards sing the same song together and have the effects stack? Could they sing different songs and have the effects stack? I know it's early, but that's a pretty basic question as for the dynamics of the new ability.

I also think that bards should parry, since they're scoundrels, jesters, and gypsies after all. A song that helped dodge and parry would also be more appropriate if they could parry.

All non casting classes are losing mp eventually. Bards are not a casting class, thus they are losing mp. You said yourself they're scoundrels :P (roguish)

Yes, bards could group and the effects would stack (Not the same song mind you -- the more powerful one would take hold and not ht lesser one, but different songs would stack)

I'd have to check...I think I gave bards parry already...

If everyone hasn't begun to already, they need to get used to the idea that mordor as they know it is going to cease to exist as far as the way all the classes work. Alot of that has already changed, such as thac0 being gone and AC changing, etc...along with attack delays and other things. The biggest thing coming, once the arcane/devine magic system is redone as Bane mentioned, will be loss of MP for the following classes: Fighter, Berserker, Thief, Assassin, Bard, Rogue, and Monk, and it is also possible Paladins, Rangers, and Death Knights will not get MP until higher levels. Werewolves and Vampires also are slated to be altered, in that they will no longer be classes, but will become afflictions - but the details of how all that work hasn't been decided yet, and will be a future project. Things are a work in progress, and this is a gigantic Beta mud, and as far as I'm concerned, everybody who is playing is a ptester!

We always encourage discussion of stuff and WILL listen to ideas - whether we will implement them or not depends on the idea.....but just remember: Mordor as you know/knew it, is gone now. Mordor is dead. It has evolved and is continuing to evolve into REALMS. We are finishing what Isengard started long ago, and we're doing it the right way, so this mud type will eventually compare to the other big mud bases, such as Diku or Circle.

Are the mp on casting classes going to increase? A mage should be casting spells from day 1 to kill, not using weapons.

Kelif wrote:

Are the mp on casting classes going to increase? A mage should be casting spells from day 1 to kill, not using weapons.

We'll get to that when we get to casters...for now...BARDS!!!

What about making bards only use instruments and not regular weapons. Since their attack is singing based, add in musical instruments for them to use in a lot more locations and all their attacking will then be based solely on song (and dance if they are gay bards).

The mighty Silver Flute of doom.

Laugh, that'd be way too hard to balance. I think weapons + instruments/songs will work out nicely.

-Bane

A bonus would be cool for a group of bards. So a group of 3 bards should be able to make an ensemble or something like that and different song combinations could have different results.

Bard 1 : Sings song of attack
Bard 2 : Sings song of blessing
Bard 3 : Sings song of healing

--The group creates an ensemble blowing out the ear drums of Bobby blaze for 200 damage while blessing each other and healing their wounds.

Or to make it simpler just have if they all 3 sing the same song it gets a bonus. So if they each sang for 50 damage they would all do 65 if they are in a group, +15 for each or something.

Also in caverns/caves songs should echo off the wall causing multiple damage, with it lessening each time it comes back and hits ya.

Song ideas: (Not sure if any of these already exist but oh well)
1) a song that puts the opposing player/monster to sleep
2) a song that causes a monster to follow and help you (enslave if you will)
3) a song that distracts a monster from attacking you (either making it attack something else in the room or stop aggroing you)
4) a song that sends you home (like word of recall)
5) a song that changes your alignment and/or faction
6) a song that lets you trick a shop(in game shop, not player owned) into selling you something at a discount (discount can be determined by a stat or luck or something)

And finally all bards should be forced to skip and not walk do to their fairy like nature.

My only worry is how important some spells are for simple playing purposes.

Having to stay grey and half the classes losing MP and not being able to cast know-aura could be a pain.

Same goes for infravision. Since losing out on a shiled just to see what you're attacking can be a major pain. Or even worse, your torch going out and being blind, especially if you're lost in a strange area.

Vigging will be an issue for a lot of classes, since none have near the HP of a zerker. Healing potions will be the talk of the town, and as of yet I don't know of anything outisde of silver scrolls and hertwood wands, and neither is super easy to get an abundance of without spending a lot of time killing worthless mobs. Although bandages are still available, but have nothing to do with healing in battle and are not a replacement for vigor.

I heard about Werewolves and Vampires moving from classes. I'll be honest and say I agree with the idea that they're afflictions. But the way the classes work is so unique and great it would be sad to lose them. It also isn't a huge issue with me because it still works with race correctly to make sense. For instance, if a minotaur was a Werewolf why would he follow the path of a Fighter? Wouldn't he just be a Werewolf?

Bards losing MP also seems odd, since in most games bards are spellcasters. Basically a mixture of rogue and untrained mage. I can see lowering mp being neccessary, or some bonus to use magical device and casting well from scrolls and wands even with low int by using some other stat. Since charisma isn't available maybe dex or piety based on what stats they'll use in the future.

Bards have a lot of room for positive change, and I'm excited to see what happens. Other classes I can see getting some boosts are thieves and druids, who are good as it is, but could go for some additional abilities. Mages could also pick a single realm to recieve bonuses.

For instance, I'm a Fire Mage and he's a Cold Mage. Mages having bonuses that cause Cold spells to have a stun effects, Fire Spells doing better damage, Lightning spells hitting additional targets, Earth spells doing damage over time, Water spells drowning opponents-stunning and doing damage randomly, and Air spells reducing cast time.

After all that, I'd like to see a dialogue with the players about the changes to races when you guys decide to add racial abilities.

Anyway, I'm glad to see what Bane has been working on for the last five years come to fruition. A solid and original codebase for other muds to be based off of. I give a lot of credit to Mordor, it's always been my favorite, but to see a code base based on it is a dream come true. But it better be for the better... *eye*